Profile 007: Kota the Friend, Independent Musician
Kota the Friend is a Brooklyn born and raised, independent creative whose artistry has been on full display for the world since 2016. A rapper with a background in instrumentation and cinematography, his three EPs — Palm Tree Liquor, Paloma Beach, and Anything — created the foundation for his 2019 debut, Foto, which took the industry by storm. On the eve of his forthcoming album, Everything, we spoke to Kota about his life as a creative, spirituality, and the power that comes from knowing your own darkness and light.
So Kota, obviously you are an artist. How would you describe yourself?
I think I'm just an artist, a creative. I'm a creative, just across the board. I just like to create things. Not only music, but anything that I can get my hands on and kind of work with and learn; any art form, I'm down to try it. So, I think my whole being is to create new things and bring new things into the world.
When did you realize that that's what you were here to do?
I think throughout my life I had hints that this was the only thing I was interested in. I was only ever interested in creating things like music and learning instruments and taking everything into a different direction. Even with regular schoolwork. There was always...even with math, there's always another way to answer a problem, you know? When the teacher would be teaching us one way, I would want to do the problem another way. So it was always about finding new things. And I think as I matured, it just developed into an actual career. And it gets even more creative when you're talking about making something lucrative, because then you have to be creative to find new ways to make money and get your art out there and be seen, so this is the perfect outlet for me.
You mentioned that there were all these moments in your life, even in math classes, where you realized you want to be creative. Are there other moments, specific moments in your memory where you can look back and say, “This was a moment that showed me who I would be, professionally or personally.”
I think when I was around seven or eight, I went to public school and we were given instruments. This is the grade that they gave us instruments and you either got the trumpet or the flute or whatever. And I was given the trumpet. And from like, day two, my teacher was calling my mom to tell her that I was gifted at this instrument and that I should be put in a different program. That was a point where I kind of knew I had something. But when you're a kid, you don't really think about it much. You think it's just this thing that you’re picking up. But I guess now that I think of it, at that time, that was a pivotal moment. Because that was my family finding out that I had a gift musically and creatively.
Interesting. People who are interested in music can go different types of directions. When did you decide to start writing through things and to write and to express yourself in that way?
I guess it started out in school, we would do little poems and things like that. And even at home, with my family and my cousins, we would get together and just try to write rhymes. So even as we little kids, we would just be in a circle writing rhymes. So that was really my first experience, really, with creative writing.
A lot of times it was just trying to match Jay Z's flow, and trying to match his wittiness. And then, you know, Biggie is this way and he does this this way. And 50 Cent, he rapped a different way. So we were trying to just mimic. At the beginning it’s just mimicry. And when I think about it, Jay Z, and Biggie and the way that they wrote, it was really like a lesson. Every time you're listening as a rapper, as a musician, every time you're listening to them, you're getting a lesson in writing and creative writing.
And so, was anyone in your family a musician? Did you have any professional creatives in your family; family members who have made money off of being creative?
I didn't know any until I kind of became successful in music. That's when I was able to connect with other people in my family that were musicians because it's like, “Oh, you need to talk to so and so. He's making money making music, too.” So that's as I got older, but I didn't know that my whole life.
Yeah, that's kind of wild though, right? It's like when you start to make your way you’re like, “Where were y’all!?”
I mean, everybody's kind of dispersed doing their own thing. That's the thing about family. Family can be distant at times, not on purpose, just because that's how it is.
Truth. Everyone's in their silo. So you had a teacher who saw your talent, and obviously your mom and your family recognize that, too. Who else helped you as you were on your way? Who helped you figure out this path, and also just inspired you to just be like, “I can take this a step further and actually do this full time?”
Man. I guess my friends. I’ve got friends that also made music and we all kind of had a similar dream. We all wanted to do music, do shows and tour the world and everything. And so I think we just really built each other up and fueled each other's dreams because we wanted it so badly, and every time one of us would get a success, we would all be inspired to kind of do something on our own. And we were always just supporting each other.
That's dope. Do you have those same friends now? Have you all maintained the friendship?
Yeah, some of them. But life happens, you know?
Yeah. I'm realizing that. There's also a lot, I think, with becoming an artist and how you grow and evolve as a person. How has work specifically forced you to grow as a soul? How has work forced you to really evolve in your personhood, values, anything like that?
I say having to do the hard work of being an artist, being independent, and trying to make it on your own...it really made me tough. It made me mentally strong, and helped me believe in myself and be confident in the tools that I have, and not necessarily needing other people or somebody else to save and rescue me to bring me to the place where I know I deserve to be. It gave me a sense of confidence, where I'm confident in what I can do. When I step into a room, I know that I'm an asset. I know that I know things that you don't know. But I know that you know things that I don't know, too, at the same time. But I'm confident in what I do know.
When did that confidence hit? When did you realize you had that confidence?
It’s something that’s built up. Every day it just gets bigger and bigger, that feeling of confidence. And it's still growing, because every day I'm learning more. Ignorance is expensive, but once you pay the price, you kind of level up and you get to the next place where it's like, wow; every time you gain a piece of information, you become more powerful.
Would you also say that it's related to your releases? As you've released more and more work and gotten the awareness up in the industry, that also helped? Or do you think that confidence is kind of independent of work?
It definitely has to do with the projects that I release and the work that I put into those, and how I navigate industry and learn and navigate it better. With every release, I just learn new things. Because it's all experience. Once you know who's holding the cards, you’re in a very special predicament, because you know the reality of every situation. And it gets crazy because you get to the point where you really uncover the industry and you uncover what it really is, and it's just like, “Wow, I thought it was this thing three years ago - I thought it was this - but really, it’s the complete opposite.” And that's how you get the confidence, because you know what it is. You're not afraid of it, you're not naive. It's no longer smoke and mirrors, it’s clear as day.
I read in an article that you did with DJ Booth about the fact that you grew up a Jehovah’s Witness, and so that is a lot of your value system. you're not practicing now?
No, I don’t actively practice.
So, having a base of spirituality, does that also help as you're navigating these rooms? Have you found having a spiritual base is at all impactful?
It's definitely impactful because that's where I got a lot of my values. I value family, I value time with my family. A big thing when you're dealing with spirituality, you have to be disconnected from the physical world in a way. Things like work, they come second to family, love, fulfillment, and real, genuine joy. So that's the reason I say no to a lot of things and a lot of big opportunities because you have to, sometimes, in order to keep your integrity intact and remain yourself and stay your authentic self.
Do you ever worry about whether your career will move forward at the same rate because you're making these decisions? Or, because of your faith, is it just like, “I know this is going to come back in the right way?”
I come to terms with things early, so I really move through this thing with no fear. When I work on an album, when I put so much into it, it's because I want to, not because I want to get this certain reaction out of it or this is gonna be the one to take me here. And if not, then I'll just try it again. It’s not that. I want to make an album because I want to do it. I really have no pressure as far as putting music out or anything. I feel no weight, I do it freely. That's the basis of my whole career. And when I'm done with music, I can do whatever. The way I feel about life is that I can do anything, you know what I mean? I’m not tied down by music or the industry, and I'm not on a record label. So I literally can do whatever the fuck I want. [laughs] It's a beautiful thing to me.
Like, if I don't want to make an album for three years or whatever, it doesn't matter; nobody's getting a percentage of my music. Nobody owns it. So I could get up and make music again and put it out. I’ve even said that if I wasn't making music, I'd probably be a gardener or something. I want to paint stuff, I want to plant flowers, and grow my own food. There's so much to life that career choices aren't the biggest choices in the world. So I'm blessed to have been making music, gotten fans, connected with people and traveled the world. And that's still not the end. There's still more to life. And I'll probably do a million more things.
When was the first time that you felt that you saw yourself? When was the first time that you saw yourself in your fullest capacity and potential and strength, and said, “This is who I am?”
I don't know if I've ever seen myself that way. I don't know if I'm there yet. I think that I'm almost there. I feel myself moving closer there. I think that this album, everything, is me manifesting that. I think my whole life has just been striving and struggling and scratching and surviving. I can't wait to be in a space where it's like the light is just beaming on my spirit, you know? And I feel lifted.
Have you had moments? I also read that you've had depression; I've had major depressive episodes. This entire series is actually inspired by the therapy that got me through. I had this one moment in it where I kind of felt myself holding myself together, and in that moment I felt so connected to who I am in the future and who I was in the past and I somehow knew that it was going to be okay. It was just a glimpse. Sometimes seeing yourself isn't that you are all that you want to be. Sometimes it's just a feeling that you're on the right path, or that you're stronger than now, or that there's so much more.
I get what you're saying. I think that that moment for me came in a very, very hectic time - pretty much one of the most hectic parts of my life - where I was unexpectedly gonna be a father. I was going to be a dad. And really, I was in no condition to be one- I wasn't making any money, I was living at home with my parents. The girl that I was dealing with, she was a mess herself. You know— we were both a complete mess. And this was happening. I had to make a lot of decisions in a short amount of time. And I think at that point, I had a conversation with myself. And I was completely depressed. I was breaking down every day, just more and more and more, to the point where it was like I was broken and jaded to everything around me. It was so crazy. I really had a conversation with myself. I was like, “So is this it? Is this gonna be it? This is really gonna be your life?” And I guess I weighed out all my options. One voice in my head is like, “Yo just get a job.” And the other voice in my head is saying “Yo, go full steam with what you want to do and make it work. You can't you can't control this thing right here. So what can you control?” And in that moment, I gained control of myself and my life and the things that I could control. And ever since then, every time I get in a place where I'm out of control, I just focus on the things I can, and it always works out.
Going through that is so critical. As a human, as a soul, as a creative, having that level of depth of understanding where you’ve confronted your darkest shadow and found your light somewhere in there is pivotal. So I salute you for that, from one person who's been in depression to another; those are the moments where we see ourselves. Then I think you end up walking through the world with that level of grace. Even though you're still striving, you're still seeing yourself, when was the first time that you felt seen in the industry? Even if it was just a glimpse, a bit of light, where it was like, “Oh, wow, I need to keep going; I'm doing something here.”
I think that moment had nothing to do with the industry, that moment where I realized, you know, I'm doing something here. I always felt like the industry is so fickle, so early on in my career, I turned my back on it. As soon as I realized how fake this shit was, how people fuck with you one day, not even answer your emails the next day, I realized that y’all don't give a fuck about me. And so why would I give a fuck about y’all? I've been moving that way ever since. I have friends in the industry, you know, I have good friends. But I consider them my friends and I don't ask them for shit. We connect with each other over music, at dinner and stuff like that, and like those are my homies.
But the first time that I actually realized I'm doing something was when I did my first show. I flew out to LA on my own dime. The people that were doing the shows, I was begging them. I was like, ‘Yo, give me a headline in LA, I can sell it out. I have mad fans out there.’ So I went to do it and I opened up for this artist - I don't even remember the name - I opened up for them, I paid for my own flight, stayed on my friend's couch, and I did the show and I was sold the headliner that night. I remember we were pulling up in the car to the show and there’s a long line down the block. And I'm like, “Bro, I think that line is for me.” And my friend was trying to humble me. He was like, “Yo, there's another venue up there, so it might not be for you.” And I appreciated it because sometimes you need that.
Yeah, you need someone to check you a little bit.
Yeah, yeah. It’s like whoa, the egos going crazy. So we were walking up to the venue, and all we hear is, “Kota! Kota! Kota!” And that was the first time I'd ever had a line at a show, period. I ended up taking pictures and signing stuff for people before I even went into the venue. I had like a 15 minute set, you know? So let me tell you, I did all of that - I flew out to Cali for a 15 minute set. And then after I left, everybody left with me.
Damn [laughs].
And that's what I mean by that's how that's how they treat you. That's how the industry treats you versus the fans. At that moment, I looked at my fans, and I'm like, “Y'all are it.” I'm only making music for the people. Fuck the industry, fuck the label, bout being noticed, I'm not doing that anymore. Because I realized it doesn't work. It’s not a sustainable way to have a career. You know? And my whole career changed because I shifted my gears towards the fans. And ever since then, my fan base has been strong. and my connection to my fans is electric.
When you work in the industry and you're at a label, you can't be a fan. There's something about it where you have to shut parts of yourself down. And it's so crazy to me. I think that there's something about being a fan that’s just like that 6lack line, “Baby let me love you like a fan.” I'm going to allow myself to fully express all of my gratitude and be moved by all my emotion and let that be okay.
It's about being genuine, and when you genuinely love somebody’s music, you shouldn't have to change depending on what room you're in. You should be able to be yourself. And I hate that about everything. That's why I don't go anywhere. Because it's like when you get in a different room, you have to act a certain way. This is something Dave Chappelle said: “Name your price in the beginning, and if it ever gets more expensive, then you get out of it.” And so I live my life that way. I am me, I am who I am, and the minute somebody says that I have to be something else or move a certain way, I'm out. I don't have to be it.
Yeah, I was just talking about the Dave Chappelle thing to my mom. My sister told me that when I got into the industry, but it was more about values: know what you will and won't do. And then when I started Scene, it became: know your price. So how do you see indie artists being able to make more space for themselves? Like, fuck the industry, how do y'all do your thing more?
I feel like it takes a lot of collaboration. I feel like if indie artists come together and collaborate, and move themselves further up the ladder, then the sky's the limit. I feel like we need indie artists to start indie companies. Not an indie label, I mean an indie company where you actually build up artists from nothing that have a whole lot of talent. And we're fair with each other. I feel like what the industry is lacking is fairness for artists. So artists need to make space for other artists to be great, and still get paid what they’re supposed to be getting paid, and still have ownership of their music so they can then do that for somebody else. I feel like that's where it's going. And that's something I want to do in my career, is create an actual company that's actually based on business ethics, rather than profit, and taking from an artist who probably grew up in the projects, isn’t business savvy, doesn't know what a contract is, doesn't know what's in his contract. It's not about getting one over that artist, it's about seeing him and seeing yeah, he's vulnerable, but you're not only can you be great, not only can you be famous, not only can you be rich, but you can have longevity. That's what's next.
Obviously, you're a great writer so you need to be vulnerable, but you touched on something that's interesting, which is vulnerability in business. And I don't think that we ever talked about that. That being able to walk into a business meeting and say, “I don't know, tell me,” or ask questions, is something folks don't want to do. Is that something that you've explored? Do you see space for vulnerability in business?
Thank you. I mean, when you're dealing with ethical people, that's the biggest thing. People are not ethical. They're thinking about their pockets and their money. And that's the nature of business in a lot of ways, it's cutthroat. But I feel like when you have two fair people, you can come together and create to make it fair for both of you.
My father always told me: ‘When you go to a businessman, your job is not to be fair for them. Your job is to fill your own pockets. Because that person is already gonna try to screw you over.’ He brings you in ready to screw you, you know? He's not bringing you in ready to be fair.
Isn’t that wild?
That is wild, but that's how it is. And that's why I don't even take meetings anymore like that. The way that I respond to deals and things like that is ridiculous. If I have a conversation with them about what I want and what I want to do, and if they send me a proposal, that is not that, then I’m literally, like, “Talk to me next year.” Just straight up. Because you're not ethical. You're not coming to me like a business person. It's insulting to me. You insulted me, and now I never want to talk to you again. That's how I treat it, you know, because it's about time that us is black creatives and black business people respond like that. Like, “Talk to me next year when the price is 10 times higher.” Come correct and talk to me like I'm somebody worth respecting. That's how I feel about that.
It’s about boundaries. It's just establishing a really hard boundary of, this is how you will and won't talk to me, treat me, see me, approach me. A lot of us are taught to have, especially as a woman, these soft boundaries.
Yeah, true, true. Most people know that; they come correct or they don't come at all. They know what it is. Now labels aren’t able to speak to me or reach me directly. It’s all good - you're not wasting my time anymore.
And you're not playing hard to get. It's just like “No, this is a moral and ethical stance” [laughs].
Yeah. Like you’d have to come with something crazy and fair. You know, like some crazy offer, you know, you couldn’t even look the other way.
Right, I feel that. So, and final words?
I wouldn't even know what to say - it’s been a great interview.